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TRIANGLE SHIRTWAIST FACTORY FIRE: ANNA GULLO’S TESTIMONY

The Triangle Shirtwaist Factory Fire in New York City on March 25, 1911, caused the deaths of 146 garment workers, mostly Jewish and Italian immigrant women aged sixteen to twenty-three. The oldest victim was Providenza Panno at 43, and the youngest were 14-year-olds Kate Leone and "Sara" Rosaria Maltese. Here is Anna Gullo’s testimony, one of the few survivors, from the trial’s transcripts.

New York, December 11, 1911.

ANNA GULLO, called as a witness on behalf of the People, being first duly sworn, testifies as follows:

(The witness states that she resides at 437 East 12th street.)

DIRECT EXAMINATION BY MR. BOSTWICK:

Q. On March 25th, 1911, were you in the employ of the Triangle Waist Company?

A. Yes, sir.

Q. How old are you?

A. I am twenty.

Q. Where were you born?

A. I was born in Italy.

Q. How many years have you been in this country?

A. I am here about twelve years.

Q. How long have you been in the employ of the Triangle Waist Company?

A. About two years and a half.

Q. And were you employed on the ninth floor?

A. Yes, sir.

Q. In what capacity? What did you do, what was your work?

A. I was an operator.

Q. Operator at a machine?

A. On a machine.

Q. Now, where were you when the fire broke out?

A. I was standing near Mary, the bookkeeper’s desk.

BY THE COURT:

Q. Whereabouts was that? Where was that desk?

A. It was near the Greene street side door.

Q. That is to say near the door going out from the ninth loft onto the Greene street side?

A. Yes, sir.

BY MR. BOSTWICK:

Q. Was it anywhere near the fire-escape?

A. No, sir.

Q. What is the first thing that attracted your attention or made you believe that there was a fire there?

A. Somebody hollered fire, and we couldn’t believe it.

Q. Where were you at that moment?

A. Right by Mary’s desk, Mary the bookkeeper's desk.

Q. What did you do and where did you go immediately that you heard the cry of fire?

A. I ran through to the Washington place side.

Q. And when you got to the Washington place door what did you do?

A. I tried the door and the door was locked.

Q. You turned the knob?

A. Yes, sir.

Q. You pulled the door?

A. Yes, sir.

Q. It wouldn't open?

A. It wouldn't open.

Q. Then where did you go?

A. I went to the elevator.

Q. And after that?

A. I thought it was no hopes for me to be saved. I went to the fourth window of Washington place, I broke the window, and I threw a pail of water and the flames came up higher; then I crossed — I done the sign of the Cross, I thought I would jump out of the window but I couldn’t -~ I had no courage to do it.

MR. STEUER: I submit, your Honor, that that is incompetent, and I move to strike it out and I ask you to tell the jury to disregard it.

THE COURT: How much do you want stricken out?

MR. STEUER: I think the whole of it is incompetent, Your Honor.

THE COURT: By “the whole” you mean what?

MR. STEUER: Right after she said she went to the window.

THE COURT: Starting with the words “I thought it was no hopes for me" and what follows, is stricken out.

MR. BOSTWICK: I would like to have it read.

MR. STEUER: I would rather have it stay in than to have it repeated so often.

THE COURT: I will allow to stay in the record “I went to the fourth window of Washington place, I broke the window and I threw a pail of water;” the balance is stricken out, that is to say, the balance of that particular answer except the part that I have allowed in is stricken out.

Q. Did you break the window?

A. I broke the window, yes.

Q. And after you went to the window and broke the window where did you go?

A. Well, then I turned back and while I was saving myself I seen a girl that says to me, “Anna, what shall I do?”, and she fell right near the Washington place side door suffocated.

Q. Do you know who that girl was?

A. Her name was Biddie Deer, Bessie Bernstein’s friend.

Q. Then where did you go after that?

A. Well, I put my skirt around my hair, put my handkerchief on my mouth, and I stooped down until I come to the Greene street side door, and I went down the stairway, and the flames were something terrible to the Greene street side.

THE COURT: Strike out “and the flames were something terrible”, and the jury will disregard it.

Q. As you got to the Greene street door were there any flames there?

A. Yes, sir.

Q. And what did you do, if anything to protect yourself from being burned by the flame? A. What would I do?

Q. What did you do?

 A. That is a question that I can’t answer.

Q. Well, did you put anything over your head or not?

A. I put my skirt around my hair.

Q. Around your head?

A. Yes, sir.

Q. And then went through the Greene street stairway door?

A. Yes, sir.

Q. And went down the Greene street stairs?

A. Yes, sir.

Q. To the street?

A. Yes, sir.

Q. When it came quitting time at night, how would the operators go home — by what

door?

A. Greene street side door.

Q. And when you went out at the Greene street side door was there a watchman there?

A. Yes, sir.

Q. And as you went out past the watchman what would you do?

A. You had to open your pocketbook and show what you had in there.

Q. When you say pocket book do you mean handbag also?

A. Yes, sir.

Q. And you all went out by the Greene street door?

A. Yes.

BY THE COURT:

Q. On the 25th of March, 1911, whereabouts were you living?

A. (No answer).

Q. Where was your home on the 25th of March 1911?

A. 437 East 12th street.

Q. That is the same place that you live in now?

A. Yes, sir.

Q. And you had been living there at that time for about how long?

A. Well, I lived there

about five years.

Q. And 437 East 12th street is between what avenues?

A. Between Avenue A and First.

BY MR. BOSTWICK:

Q. Did you ever use the Washington place door to the stairway?

A. No, sir.

Q. Did you ever see it used?

A. No, sir.

Q. Did you ever during the period that you were employed thers have any fire drills in

that factory?

A. No, sir.

[cut]

Q. Were there any members of your family in the employ of the Triangle Waist Company at the time of the fire?

A. Yes.

Q. Did you see any other person before you went to the door and tried it and couldn’t open it, try the door?

A. No, sir.

Q. Did you see anybody try the door after you tried it?

A. After I went away there was quite a few girls standing there by it, trying the door.

MR. STEUER: I object to that as being her conclusion, and as incompetent, and I

move to strike it out.

MR. BOSTWICK: I withdraw the question.

Q. State what you saw them do.

THE COURT: The answer is stricken out, and the jury will disregard it.

A. I saw them trying that door.

BY MR. STEUER: CROSS EXAMINATION:

Q. What did you say your name was?

A. Well, at first I gave my name Anna Weller, that was my mother’s name.

Q. And now you use your father’s name?

A. Yes, Anna Gullo.

Q. There was a long time when you didn’t use your father’s name, is that it?

A. Yes, sir.

Q. A. period of about twenty years?

A. Well, the first time I went to school they couldn’t pronounce my name, so they put me as Anna. Weller; it was easy for them.

Q. You mean to tell these twelve men that it was easier to put Weller than it was Gullo, and that is why your name was Weller?

MR. BOSTWICK: I object to the question, as to its form.

THE COURT: Well, leave you out “you mean to tell these twelve men”, and I will allow it. You may ask her if that was the reason.

Q. Is that the reason?

A. Well, not the reason —-

Q. No, I don’t care. There is no unpleasantness sought to be brought out here, but that was not the reason, was it?

A. No.

Q. I understood you to say to the jury that you were near to the Greene street door?

A. No, by Mary’s desk, Mary the bookkeeper’s desk.

Q. Didn’t you tell the judge in answer to a question put by him that Mary’s desk was near the Greene street door?

A. Yes, sir.

Q. And you were by Mary’s desk?

A. Yes.

Q. Well, then, when you first heard "Fire", you were near the Greene street door, were you?

A. Well, I thought I couldn’t go out through Greene street.

THE COURT: Strike that out. You simply pay attention and answer it.

(Question repeated.)

A. Yes, sir.

Q. And you had worked for two years in that place, and had always used the Greene street door?

A. Yes, sir.

Q. You tell this jury you never saw anybody use the Washington place door?

A. No.

Q. And the Washington place door was quite a distance away from the Greene street door, wasn't it?

A. Yes.

Q. But when you heard the cry of fire the first thing you did was to go for the door that

you never had used in all the two years you had worked there, isn’t that so?

A. Yes.

Q. What?

A. Yes.

Q. Well, now, right near where you stood by Mary’s desk were the two Greene

street elevators, weren’t they?

A. No, I didn’t see the elevators.

Q. You didn’t see them?

A. No.

Q. Well, you had seen them for two years every day, hadn’t you?

A. Well, I know the elevators were there.

Q. You had gone up and down in those elevators for two years every day, hadn’t you?

A. Yes.

Q. So you knew very well where they were, didn’t you?

A. Yes.

Q. But you didn’t go near those elevators, although you were right by them, when you heard the cry of fire, isn’t that so?

A. Well, I couldn’t go because the fire started on Greene street side.

Q. Well, there was nothing between Mary’s desk and the Greene street elevators at that time, in the nature of fire, was there?

A. (No answer).

Q. (Showing People’s Exhibit 2) You show the jury where Mary’s desk was. Down where you are sitting, that is Greene street, ever here is Washington place, all the way down, see?

A. Yes.

Q. Over here where my finger is now, that is the Washington place staircase, do you see it?

A. I see.

Q. And there is the Washington place door, do you see that?

A. Yes.

Q. Over here are the two Washington place elevators?

A. Yes, I see them.

Q. Now, right over here in this corner are the Greene street elevators, and here is the Greene street door; is that right?

A. Yes, sir.

Q. Now, where was Mary’s desk?

A. There was the door from the Greene street side, and here where Mary’s desk was standing, about that far away (indicating on diagram).

Q. Let us get that right. You see, here is the first of the tables?

A. Yes, on the Greene street side.

Q. Nearest the Greene street side?

A. Yes

Q. Do you mean to say that Mary’s desk was between the first and second table on the Greene street side?

A. No.

Q. Then when you said it was over here that was because you did not understand the diagram, or this drawing. Now, you remember there was a clothes closet on the Greene street side?

A. Yes, sir.

Q. That clothes closet —

A. Is right here (indicating).

Q. Yes; show the jury again where Mary’s desk was?

A. Well, Mary’s desk was right near the dressing room, it was the fourth table from the machine.

Q. What is that?

A. The fourth table from the machines. It comes Greene street — there was one row of machines — second, third and fourth, right there (indicating and pointing on diagram.)

Q. Then you would put Mary’s desk over here (indicating on diagram)?

A. Yes.

Q. Tell the jury how near to the wall where the fire-escape was, that Mary's desk was?

A. It was about three windows away from there.

Q. Which way, three windows away?

A. From the Greene street side.

Q. From the Greene street side?

A. Yes.

Q. And how far out into the loft from the wall where the fire escape was was Mary’s desk?

A. Well, it was not far away from the fire escape.

Q. Do I make myself clear to you? Do you understand me entirely?

A. (No answer).

BY THE COURT:

Q. How far was it from the nearest window?

A. How far was it from the nearest window?

Q. How far was Mary’s desk from the window that was nearest to the desk?

A. Well, this is Mary’s desk (indicating). Well, it was about that far (indicating).

Q. No, how far was Mary’s desk from the window that was back of the desk?

A. It was not far.

Q. Can you show us in this room?

A. Well, like from a point right over to that window, right over there (indicating).

Q. Suppose you are sitting at Mary's desk, how far away was the nearest window?

A. Well, for instance, this is Mary’s desk (indicating the diagram and the end of diagram resting on lap of the witness); and the windows are right over there, over by that window there, the first window.

Q. You mean the one at the end of the jury box?

A. Yes.

THE COURT: That is a distance of about fifteen feet.

Q. The window that you are speaking of is a window that is in the hall on the side of

the fire-escape?

A. Yes, sir.

Q. Don’t say yes unless you understand me.

Mary’s desk was fifteen feet away from a window?

A. Yes.

Q. Don’t say yes unless you understand me. Mary’s desk was fifteen feet away from a

window?

A. Yes.

Q. And that window was a window in the same wall that the window was that you went out to the fire-escape on?

A. Yes, there was a fire-escape on.

Q. In other words, Mary’s desk was about fifteen feet inside of the loft in a straight line from the window nearest to it?

A. Yes, sir.

Q. And that window was a window in the same wall as the window opening out on to

the fire-escape; is that so?

A. Yes, sir.

BY MR. STEUER:

Q. Was Mary’s desk near any wall?

A. No.

Q. What was Mary?

A. A bookkeeper.

Q. On the ninth floor?

A. Yes.

BY THE COURT:

Q. What was Mary’s last name?

A. Mary Luventhal.

BY MR. STEUER:

Q. How far was this door which went from the loft to the door that went to the stairway on the Greene street side?

A. I don’t understand.

Q. (Continuing) Was Mary’s desk? How far from this door here?

A. There is Mary’s desk, and about here is the door.

THE COURT: Make a mark where you say Mary’s desk was.

A. Right here.

THE COURT: Mark it.

Q. Near the fourth table?

A. Near the fourth table.

Q. How far from the fourth table was Mary’s desk? About how far? Tell the Jury.

A. Well, here stands the table, and that far was Mary’s desk from the table (indicating). Suppose there is the machines —

Q. No, - suppose that wall there (indicating east wall of court room) is the end of the fourth table nearest to the fire-escape wall.

A. Yes.

Q. You see?

A. Yes.

Q. How far from the end of that table, or how far from that wall over toward the fireescape was Mary’s desk?

A. Well, here comes the fire-escape and here comes the table (indicating)

Q. Well, I have not made myself clear –

BY THE COURT:

Q. There was a row of tables upon which machines stood; do you understand that?

A. Yes.

Q. There was one along by the Greene street wall, that is Table 1?

A. 1.

Q. With machines on it?

A. Yes.

Q. There was another one after that?

A. Yes, 2, 3 and 4 (indicating).

Q. You put your finger there on the fourth table, and you put your finger on the end of that table which is nearest to the fire-escape wall; do you see that?

A. Yes.

Q. You have done that. Now, how far from the end of that table was the beginning of Mary’s desk? Suppose you stood at the end of that table?

A. Well, Mary’s desk was about that far away from the machine (indicating).

MR. BOSTWICK: The wall ends there. It couldn’t be out in the street.

THE WITNESS: Well, I don’t understand this (diagram) at all.

BY MR. STEUER:

Q. You know what a yard is, don’t you?

A. Yes, I do know.

Q. You know when you measure cloth with a yard stick?

A Yes.

Q. Have you got in your mind about what distance is covered by a yard?

A. Yes.

Q. You have seen a yard stick yourself a great many times over on the cutting tables where they lay the cloth out?

A. Yes.

Q. Tell the judge and the jury, from the fourth table — you see?

A. Yes.

Q. You have got a yard stick in your hand?

A. Well, from the machine Mary’s table would measure about seven yards.

Q. About as such as seven yards?

A. Yes.

Q. You thought it was seven yards away, did you?

A. Yes.

Q. That is the nearest you can come to it?

A. Yes.

Q. Of course you don’t know much about distances?

A. No.

Q. And we are not holding you down to that, but what I want you to understand is this: Before, when you were down somewhere near the fourth table —

A. Yes.

Q. And by Mary’s desk, which was some where near the fourth table and nearer to the wall than the fourth table, then you heard a cry of fire?

A. Yes.

Q. And as soon as you heard the cry of fire you started to come away over here at the Washington place door?

A. Yes.

Q. That was nine flights up that you were, wasn’t it?

A. Yes.

Q. You didn’t go near the elevator to ring the elevator bell, so the elevator should come up and take you down, did you?

A. No.

Q. And you didn’t go over to the Greene street side to ring the same elevator that you had been going up and down in, for two years, did you?

A. No.

Q. And you didn’t go over to the Greene street stairs where you had been for two years before?

A. I couldn’t go.

THE COURT: Yes or no to that.

Q. You didn’t, did you?

A. No.

Q. The only thing you did was to go to the one door that you had never used in your life in that place, isn’t that so?

A. Yes.

Q. And then when you tried that door, and that door did not open, then you did not ring the elevator bell, did you?

A. No.

Q. And you never went near the elevator?

A. I did went near the elevator.

Q. Not to try the elevator?

A. Well, there was so many crowded there I couldn’t get near the elevator.

Q. But you left the Washington place door and you want over to the fourth window on the Washington place side?

A. Yes, sir.

Q. And you took a pail and you broke the window?

A. Yes.

Q. It took you some time to come from where you were at Mary’s table over to the Washington place door, didn’t it?

A. Yes.

Q. And then you looked over toward the elevator and you saw a crowd of girls there?

A. Yes.

Q. When you were at the Washington place door nobody crowded near you?

A. Yes.

Q. Oh, did they?

A. Yes.

Q. A big crowd of girls crowded you there?

A. Yes.

Q. Before you did you see any other girl try that door?

A. No, I was the first on.

Q. And did you see any other man try that door?

A. Well, I left a much crowd —

Q. I didn’t ask you that. I asked you whether you with your eyes saw any man try that door while you were there? A. Well, it was Willie, the machinist, that tried the door.

Q. Willie the machinist?

A. Yes.

Q. And when you say Willie the machinist, you mean Willie Greenspan?

A. I don’t know his second name.

Q. Anyhow, it was Willie the machinist on the ninth floor?

A. Yes.

Q. Now, there is no question that you saw with your own eyes Willie the machinist go over to that door?

A. Yes, tried that door with me.

Q. Don’t you know that Willie the machinist opened the door, that the smoke came through in great volume, and almost knocked him down?

A. If Willie, the machinist, had opened the door, he would go up the stairway, but he went through the roof.

Q. When Willie the machinist saw the smoke and the flames, didn’t he, while you were standing there jam that door shut?

A. He did not. He tried that door and he ran up from the roof. He didn’t even say a word to us.

Q. Well, anyway, you saw Willie the machinist at the door?

A. Yes, I seen him.

Q. And you saw Willie with his hand —

A. Trying that door.

THE COURT: One at a time.

Q. You know Sam Bernstein, don’t you?

A. Yes, I do.

Q. Did you see Sam Bernstein?

A. No.

Q. Did Sam Bernstein come and push you away and get hold of the door knob?

A. Well, maybe I didn’t see him.

Q. Did you see Sam Bernstein at all at that time?

A. No.

Q. Did any girl push you away and take hold of the doorknob?

A. Well, I left the door myself and some other girls were trying this door.

Q. I am asking you whether a girl pushed you away and took hold of the doorknob?

A. No, nobody pushed me.

Q. The only person, that you can tell this jury, that you saw take hold of that door knob was Willie the machinist, on the ninth floor, is that right?

A. Well, yes.

Q. You went away and you say you broke a window on the ninth floor?

A. Yes.

Q. You took a pail of water?

A. Yes.

Q. And with that pail of water smashed in the window?

A. I threw it.

Q. You mean threw the water ?

A. Yes.

Q. Was it the water that broke the window?

A. No; I broke the window myself, and then I threw a pail of water and the flames came up higher.

Q. What did you break the window with?

A. With my hand.

Q. You smashed the fourth window on the ninth floor with your hand?

A. Yes.

Q. And then you grabbed a pail of water to throw it?

A. Yes.

Q. And that was because you saw flames?

A. Yes.

Q. And you thought that by taking the pail of water —

A. I thought I could help myself.

Q. You thought by taking the pail of water and throwing it on the flames, the flames would go out?

A. That is what I thought.

Q. And what you intended to do was to get out of that window and stop on the cornice, the same as you saw other girls do, isn’t that so?

A. I don’t know what you mean.

Q. Do you recognise that at all (showing witness People’s Exhibit 18)?

A. Yes, I do.

Q. That is a picture of the building (referring to People’s Exhibit 18). Between the eight and the ninth floor, and just below the ninth floor, there was a sort of a place that came out from the wall where you saw some girls standing?

A. I didn’t see any girls standing there.

Q. Is that where you tried to get?

A. Well, there wasn’t any on the ninth floor.

BY THE COURT:

Q. Did you try to get out of the window and stand on the part of the building that was outside of the window?

A. No, sir, I didn’t try to get out from the window.

BY MR. STEUER:

Q. What did you threw the water on the flame for? A. Well, I thought I could save some other girls. You know, the girls were on the eight floor hollering too.

Q. Do you mean to tell the jury —

MR. BOSTWICK: I object to the form of the question.

Q. Well, do you mean to testify —

MR. BOSTWICK: I object to that form of quest ion.

THE COURT: Just ask her a question.

Q. When you had gone to the door end couldn’t get out — A. No.

Q. And you went over —

THE COURT: Will you please listen? You wait until the question is finished before you say a word.\

Q. And you went over to the Washington place side and broke the window with your hand?

A. Yes.

Q. Did you do that to try and save girls on the eighth floor that were screaming?

A. No.

Q. What did you break the window with your hand for? A. Well, I couldn't help it. I couldn't open it.

Q. What did you do it for? A. I did it because I was trying to holler for some helps.

Q. Then it was to holler for help that you broke the window?

A. Yes.

Q. Not to save anybody or help anybody on the eighth floor?

A. No.

Q. Then after you broke a window you took a pail?

A. Yes.

Q. This pail of water?

A. Yes.

Q. And you spilt it out of the window that you broke?

A. Yes.

Q. What did you do that for?

A. Well, I don’t know, I done it, but I don’t know what I done it for.

Q. You said a moment ago you did this to save some girts on the eighth floor. Did you mean that? A. No, I didn’t mean that.

Q. Whatever you did at that time, you either didn't know why you did it or you were doing it because you thought it would help you, isn't that so?

A. Yes.

Q. When you were there and had broken that window did the flames shoot up in front of you?

A. Yes.

Q. And did you grab that pail in the belief that if you spilt that water on the flame, the flame would go out.

Q. What did you do with the pail?

A. I threw it on the floor.

Q. After you had spilt the water?

A. Yes.

Q. Then you stood there and saw that instead of the flame going out the flame was getting bigger and stronger?

A. Then I went away from the window.

Q. Then you dropped the pail and went away?

A. Yes.

Q. After you went away from the fourth window you then turned around?

A. Yes.

Q. And what did you do?

A. I turned around, I put my handkerchief around my mouth, and my skirt around my hair, and I stooped down to the floor, to get out the Greene street side door.

Q. Here is window No. 1, No. 2, No. 3, No. 4 (indicating on diagram, People’s Exhibit

2), do you see?

A. Yes.

Q. And this is where you are (indicating)?

A. Yes.

Q. In front of a window?

A. Yes.

Q. At that time, the fourth window from the Washington place side, beginning to count near the Washington place elevators, that is right, isn’t it?

A. Yes.

Q. When you see the flame here, and after you have already put the pail down, you take your handkerchief and you put it in your mouth, is that right?

A. I put it around my mouth.

Q. You put the handkerchief around your mouth because at that time the smoke was already beginning to choke you?

A. Oh, the smoke was terrible.

Q. It was terrible at that time?

A. Yes, sir.

Q. The smoke was coming in big volumes?

A. Yes.

Q. Do you know what volumes are?

A. No.

Q. I mean much.

A. Very much.

Q. Yes, at one time, and it was puffing in?

A. Yes.

Q. And the smoke was affecting you?

A. Yes.

Q. And so you turned around that way, and then this smoke was coming in in big volumes, you saw a girl that fell down that was already suffocated with smoke?

A. Yes.

Q. And then when you had your handkerchief around your mouth, you thought it would help to keep the smoke out of your mouth?

A. Yes.

Q. That is what you put it there for?

A. Yes.

Q. Then you put your skirt over your head?

A. Yes.

Q. And you got down and you began to crawl all the way over here to the Greene street door?

A. Yes.

Q. And you got to the Greene street door so that you could get through safely, and still went down the Greene street steps?

A. Yes.

Q. When you saw Willie at the door — the machinist ~~ didn’t you follow Willie

when he left the door?

A. No.

BY THE COURT:

Q. What did you see Willie do at the door (referring to the machinist)?

A. Trying that door.

Q. Who passed away from that door first, you or Willie?

A. Well, I passed away.

Q. You left the door before Willie left it, is that so?

A. Yes, sir.

Q. That is to say, at the time that you went away from the Washington place door Willie the machinist was at that door, is that so?

A. Yes, sir.

Q. Did you see what, if anything, Willie the machinist did at that door?

A. No, sir.

Q. Was Willie, the machinist at that door before you came to it?

A. No, sir.

Q. Did he get to that door while you were at it?

A. Well, after I went away.

Q. You had already left the door when Willie got to the door?

A. Yes, sir.

Q. How far were you from the door when Willie reached the door?

A. Right near the elevator.

Q. And when you say the elevator, what elevator do you mean?

A. Washington place.

Q. You were near the Washington place elevators when Willie the machinist reached the Washington place door?

A. Yes.

Q. Was Willie the machinist alone whan he got to that door?

A. Well, there was a crowd after him, there were other girls standing there trying that door.

Q. Did you see what, if anything, Willie the machinist did to that door?

A. He tried that door.

Q. When you say tried that door what do you mean?

A. Well, he was trying to open that door.

Q. What did he do?

A. He see he couldn’t open the door —

Q. No, what did you see him do?

A. Just tried the door to see if hm could open it.

Q. When you say tried the door what do you mean?

A. He was trying to see if he could open the door.

Q. What did he do with his hand?

A. On the handle and tried to push that door and it didn’t open, so he went away from there.

Q. Did you see him going away?

A. Well, I didn’t see him going away, but he claimed —

Q. The last you saw of him he was at that door, is that so?

A. Yes.

BY MR. STEUER:

Q. Will you please tell the jury when you were working when you worked?

A. On the first table machine, on the Greene street side.

Q. That would be down here (indicating)?

A. Right here.

Q. Will you tell the jury, on that table, where you worked?

A. Where I worked?

Q. Yes, just tell the jury when you sat at the table which way were your eyes? Did you

face the windows on Greene street, or was your back to them?

A. Back to the windows.

Q. So that you were sitting on this side of the table (indicting)?

A. On this side, yes.

THE COURT: Her answer, Mr. Steuer, indicates that she was sitting on the other side.

Q. Oh, then you were sitting on that side of the table (indicating)?

A. Yes.

Q. That is, you were sitting nearest to the Greene street windows, with your eyes away from the Greene street window?

A. Yes.

Q. Commencing with the clothes closet on this side of the table, show us where you were sitting?

A. Well, I was sitting about as far away, from here, like that.

Q. How many machines?

A. Well, I was No. 15.

Q. How many machines?

A. Well, I was fifteen machines away from the —~

Q. Fifteen machines from the clothes closet?

A. That’s right.

Q. Then you must have been the eighth machine on this side (indicating on diagram)?

A. No, I was No. 15.

Q. Wouldn’t that make you No. 15 if you were the eighth machine? Did you begin your numbers at this side, do you know?

A. Where?

Q. Where was No. 1?

A. No. 1 was at the Washington side.

BY THE COURT:

Q. Which window was immediately back of you, the window nearest to the clothes closet, or beyond that?

A. The second window.

Q. Was that behind you?

A. Yes, sir.

Q. Directly behind you?

A. Yes, sir, that was the first window and that was the second window (indicating on diagram).

BY MR. STEUER:

Q. And that is where you start?

A. Just right there.

Q. Did you ever go over to the Washington place door before that time?

A. No, sir.

Q. Did you ever look at the Washington place door before that time?

A. Did I ever look at the door?

Q. Yes.

A. Well, I ever looked at the door.

Q. How?

A. I did look at the door.

Q. When, do you remember?

A. Well, I don’t remember.

Q. Did you see the key that was in that door?

A. There was never a key there.

Q. So that you don't remember looking at it, but you tell the jury when you testify now that there never was a key in door?

A. There never was a key in that door.

MR. RUBIN: She said she did look at the door.

THE WITNESS: You asked me if I remembered -—

Q. How often did you look at it?

A. I don’t know how often; that is a thing I couldn’t tell you.

Q. You say that the key wasn't in the door?

A. There was never a key in the door, not that I know.

Q. Not that you know?

A. No.

Q. Which member of your family is it that brought this case against Harris and Blanck?

A. Mary Gullo.

Q. Then you must have a case against them too, haven’t you? Because there is more than one. Who is Annie?

A. I am Annie.

Q. You are Annie?

A. Yes.

Q. Is that the name which you gave here?

A. Yes, Anna Gullo.

Q. Then you are suing them. And is it your mother that is suing?

A. I have no mother, we are not suing him for anything.

Q. What do you mean, you are not suing? Don’t you know that Anna Gullo has brought a suit against Harris and Blanck? Didn’t you go to a lawyer?

A. Never did. Oh, yes, I don’t know what he (Mr. Steuer) is talking about.

Q. What?

A. I don’t know what you are talking about.

Q. You don’t know what I am talking about?

A. No.

Q. Well, you know that after the fire you didn’t work for Harris and Blanck?

A. No.

Q. And after the fire you went to the Italian Consul’s office?

A. Yes.

Q. And told the Italian Consul whatever you told him?

A. Yes.

Q. And then the Italian Consul made the claim for you against Harris and Blaack?

A. Yes.

Q. And also after that turned it over to a lawyer to attend to it for you?

A. Yes.

Q. Do you know how much you are suing them for?

A. No.

Q. Do you knew that you got two cases, one where you asked to be paid for something that happened to you, and another where you ask to be paid because a member of your family was lost in the fire?

MR. BOSTWICK: Just a minute. First state whether you know.

MR. STEUER: I am asking her if she knows.

MR. BOSTWICK: Don’t state if you don’t know. State if you know, and if you don’t know you may say so?

A. I don’t know what you are saying.

Q. How old did you say you are?

A. I am twenty.

MR. STEUER: I don’t know whether it would be quite fair on my part to ask her whether she makes any claim, because I wouldn’t use it against her at any other time, if I did.

RE-DIRECT EXAMINATION BY MR. BOSTWICK:

Q. After this fire you went to see the Italian Consul, didn’t you?

A. Yes.

Q. And whatever has happened in regard to the result of that visit to the Italian Consul, you don’t know?

A. No.

 

SOURCE:

Complete transcripts of the 1911 criminal trial against the owners of the Triangle Waist factory - Cornell University.

Wikipedia